SPEAKER_01 0:00

The O Brother Podcast is going to be at San Diego Comic-Con this year, Mike. What? The O Brother Podcast is going to be. You and me, the two of us that you see here are good. It's like cannonball run. These bleeds? Yeah, those bleeds. I'm going to stick those bleeds up your nose.

SPEAKER_02 0:17

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 0:22

You're listening to the O Brother Podcast. Real Brothers, Real Talk. Welcome to the O Brother Podcast. I'm your host, Dan Smith. Alongside me, he's always my brother from the same other, Mike Smith. Dan's kind of an old mug there. This is the old uh O Brother. Yeah, one of the original logos. The OG. You remember the original logo for the podcast? I brought it up once or twice. You know, we tried to see that. In the original, it was Old Brother of Podcast Bought Nothing. We were kind of ripping off a Seinfeld reference.

SPEAKER_02 0:56

I don't remember that.

SPEAKER_01 0:57

And it was the most basic logo you could possibly ever think of. Handmade. Were we in it? Needless to say. No, no, no. It was just like an icon. It was really terrible clip art. I mean, it was it was horrible. Yeah. It was in those early delusional days of the pandemic, you know.

SPEAKER_02 1:13

Yeah, right. So we're gonna get to millions of followers.

SPEAKER_01 1:17

That's right. That's right. We've come a long way in that time, though.

SPEAKER_02 1:21

We certainly just a hair short, but yeah, we're getting there.

SPEAKER_01 1:25

So Project Hail Mary, Mike, we did a first look on this about four months ago, and we're really impressed by the trailer. Like we're both, you know, really looking forward to this one, anticipating this one. And um, and it's it's done very well at the box office. It's it's now just to state up front, I watched this using a free trial, honestly, with MGM, you know, one of the streaming services out there, uh Amazon, right? And and so I've seen the film nearly three times at this point. Almost not quite completely, but close. I can see why, because it's a very dense story. It is very dense, yeah. And and also, and I'll get into it a little bit as we as we talk about it, but but but but before we we get into it, so how did you end up viewing it? Was it through MGM as well?

SPEAKER_02 2:26

Yeah, MGM I joined for 99 cents for two months. And it's got by the time that runs out, it when it goes to MGM Plus, it shows up in prime. That's its next stop. So Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 2:42

Well, I think for me, uh my expectations were so high for this film, given uh all of the talk, I mean the reviews pretty much, you know, the audience uh reception and reviews. The book was suit was super popular, and and right, and the readers of the book were really high on the film too, which is a pretty good endorsement, right?

SPEAKER_02 3:07

Yeah, and I didn't talk about this in the first look, but I was at Barnes and Noble, you know, during one of their movie sales, and I picked up the book. This is like a couple of years ago. And I'm like, it was way too over like I'm not a good science guy. Right.

SPEAKER_01 3:28

Math, but not the science part.

SPEAKER_02 3:29

Math I'll take all day long, but science is my Achilles heel. And it's very scientific. And I just couldn't gain any ground. I wound up not buying the book because I'm like, there's no way I can't even get through the first chapter in the store. I don't think I'm gonna get any further at home.

SPEAKER_01 3:54

I've I've I had a similar experience with a book I'm reading on AI that is so incredibly dense. Yeah. It's a very slow read, but um but yeah.

SPEAKER_02 4:05

This is the guy that the author of this wrote Martian.

SPEAKER_01 4:09

Andy Weir.

SPEAKER_02 4:11

Right. Andy Weir wrote Martian, which starred Matt Damon. And he's got another book called Artemis that's gonna be directed by Lord Miller, who directed this film.

SPEAKER_01 4:25

It's in development, I believe.

SPEAKER_02 4:27

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 4:28

Yeah, which is a space reference right there, you know, with uh, you know, the Artemis missions and uh the things that we're seeing in, you know, actually happening in real life. You talk about Andy Weir, so he, you know, his background is as I believe a computer engineer or software engineer, if I'm not mistaken. And so he understands a lot of the science, and not to mention just the deep research that he's done. I'm sure that his network of friends and colleagues all swim in those circles. And you know, you talk about the Martian, which I think I think it's a slightly better film than Project Tail Mary. Um you know, not not by not by much.

SPEAKER_02 5:12

You're saying Martian is better.

SPEAKER_01 5:14

Yeah, I think Martian is is better. For me. For me.

SPEAKER_02 5:18

Yeah. They're close.

SPEAKER_01 5:19

But they're close. And in this, again, I I said my my expectations really high going in, and I thoroughly enjoyed the movie. I mean, I've I've stood, you know, uh through it almost three times, as I said, but there's something I can't quite put my finger on. It's very, very minor uh nits to pick with it. You know, for me, and I've said on the podcast numerous times, now you may not be a science guy, but you're certainly a science fiction guy when it comes to film and TV. You know, Twilight's like you name it, that you're down for it, right? And so, and but for me, when it gets a little too fantastical and it starts being it starts feeling less grounded in the real world, that's where I get off the train.

SPEAKER_02 6:09

This warps reality to to you know our current day. It's funny because I told you I'm watching last time we talked, I was in the middle of Lost, a sci-fi. That's right. And I'm in the middle of or at the end of the second season of 24.

SPEAKER_01 6:27

Did you know that there's uh uh six degrees of Matthew Fox here with the Lost series? I didn't. No. So so uh Drew Goddard, who wrote the Martian screenplay and also wrote the screenplay for this. Yes, because Lord Miller were busy working on the Spider-Verse franchise and couldn't pen the screenplay, so they brought Drew Goddard in. So he already had a relationship with Andy Weir on The Martian. Well, Drew Goddard also wrote and was an executive producer on Lost with J.J. Abros.

SPEAKER_02 7:02

I didn't know that.

SPEAKER_01 7:03

Yeah. So there was a I I thought of you because I knew you were doing a deep dive into Lost. Yeah. But you know, Lord Miller, we talked about during the first look, their background, and this is really their first directorial effort. You know, a lot of writing credits and producing. Did they direct Cloudy with a chance of meatballs?

SPEAKER_02 7:25

I don't did they directly no, but the last directorial feature from them was 22 Jump Street.

SPEAKER_01 7:32

22 Jump Street, right? I almost thought you were gonna say solo a Star Wars story, which we talked about in the first look, because of course they got famously fired from that project.

SPEAKER_02 7:42

Doesn't, you know, we're gonna get into this film, but doesn't it make you want to see that cut even more?

SPEAKER_01 7:50

It does. And and I I really have no issue with with their work here directing the film. I thought it was especially given the scope of this film. You know, I I went down a huge rabbit hole with a lot of behind the scenes and making of and you know, watching Neil deGrasse Tyson interview Andy Weir. Like I was all over the place watching uh a lot of behind the scenes stuff and making of and um you know the science of it and everything. And I just I've only gained greater respect for what they were able to do by by viewing a lot of that material.

SPEAKER_02 8:28

And we should set it up, Pierre. Yeah, you know, go ahead.

SPEAKER_01 8:32

Well, you remember you remember the uh first look, Mike. I read the synopsis at that time on IMDB, which was a little mysterious. Just said an astronaut tries to save Earth while alone in space. That that was the whole which still is a pretty good description for it. But give a look give a little bit more to it.

SPEAKER_02 8:51

Well, he's a science teacher, and he's doing he's been doing work on what's called I'm gonna say it wrong. Astrophage. Astrophage. Astrophage. Good job. Which is like an energy source that multiplies really fast, and it can be used for fuel. So right now, like if we wanted to go where this film went in space, it would take us 23 years to get there. So it's not viable to go, and then you would have no fuel to come back anyway. So, anyways, I I got off point there. It's a school teacher who's picked to man this mission with two other astronauts, although he's not an astronaut, which he clearly tries to point out.

SPEAKER_01 9:44

He says I put the I put the knot in astronaut, he says.

SPEAKER_02 9:49

But because of his work with astrophage, it was important for him to be a part of it. No one else really believed in his his theory.

SPEAKER_01 10:00

Yeah, he he basically what it was was that his dissertation uh we mate makes a claim that, you know, uh water is not necessarily necessary for all forms of life, was kind of the argument he's making, which was an unpopular opinion, as you find. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:22

Now he wakes up. The the film is us watching him wake up from a coma that he is out in space, only to find that the other astronauts had died, which wasn't a big shock. They w they weren't expected to kind of make the whole trip. But he's out there by himself in space with nobody to communicate with, because there's no communication from that distance.

SPEAKER_03 10:54

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 10:55

And he developed or he uh finds another life force that actually kind of finds him. And he figures a way to communicate with this, which is known as Rocky in the film. And if you watch the first look, we saw the little kind of puppet of Rocky.

SPEAKER_01 11:15

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 11:16

But I had no idea where that was going. Right, right. How big a part of the story that would be.

SPEAKER_01 11:23

Well, and and what's interesting is you find you come to discover they both face a similar threat from this planets. Right, right, because the astrophage is it's it's essentially taking energy from the sun, which it uses for propulsion. And it's about as deep as we'll probably get here with the science. Right. But because it took me a while to sort of wrap my head around that. And but what I loved is Ryan Gosling, who plays Ryland Grace, R G R G. Right. He said he in explaining that to the uh is what's her uh Eva Stratt is the head of this project Hail Mary.

SPEAKER_02 12:08

Played by Sandra Hooler.

SPEAKER_01 12:11

Sandra Houler, correct, correct. And as he's explaining how they do that, he says they basically toot to scoot. You know, they they excrete that astrophage out and it it helps them propel or whatever. So but the result of that, of course, is that the sun is dying, essentially. Right. And that's gonna have catastrophic effects on Earth in the next 30 years.

SPEAKER_02 12:40

And the two of them are both facing the same extinction of their species.

SPEAKER_01 12:47

Yes.

SPEAKER_02 12:48

So in a sense, they're working together to solve this same problem. Now, Rocky has a benefit as he's not human, so he survives in a different way. But I was fascinated by that whole portrayal of how they bring A we always know when they do anti-gravity scenes, a lot of times they're doing a real deep dive in a plane, so they're actually experiencing, but this is done by wires.

SPEAKER_01 13:24

That this was one of the most fascinating things, is this the technology. I mean, again, now we had Michael Rolla on the podcast who did the the visual effects for Sinners. It was nominated for an Oscar, and this was another great example of the the work that these creatives do on films like this is just it's astounding. You know, it to I would love the chance to just be a fly on the wall to watch them do their work, but specific to what you're talking about, there was this thing they came up with called the spin ring. It was a ring that Ryan Gosling would be it'd be in the suit, it'd be in this ring, and the ring would be attached to cables to wires.

SPEAKER_02 14:11

Apparently not really comfortable either.

SPEAKER_01 14:13

It didn't look very comfortable because I I've seen it in action. And it would allow him to move basically 360, creating the illusion of zero gravity, which created a much more realistic look of it in the film. And it was just um just again another uh stunning demonstration of ingenuity uh that that they were able to put on screen here. Now, we mentioned the principal cast by Scosling, who I he just continues to endear himself to me. This is no different, this performance here, because he's got just such a broad range of talent. The camera loves it.

SPEAKER_02 14:57

Yeah, I don't I couldn't think of anyone else that would have pulled this off.

SPEAKER_01 15:02

Well, and I mean, talk about look look at his science fiction resume. Now, I still have not seen Blade Runner 2049. I will. But you gotta see. I'm gonna do like a double feature with the original and the sequel. But he's got that first man, which you talked about. He's about to star in the next Star Wars film next year, Starfighter. Right. And I think there's others too. Um, I think I'm forgetting some that he's been in, but probably.

SPEAKER_02 15:30

And this is his second most successful box office film next to Barbie, which did huge, huge.

SPEAKER_01 15:38

Again, there's a demonstration of his range, you know, just those two films. Sandra uh Houler, who you mentioned, plays Eva Strat, and then James Ortiz, who's a puppeteer by trade, but but ends up voicing Rocky.

SPEAKER_02 15:54

Right. And he expected the whole time that a an actor was gonna come in and do those lines. What did you think of of the voice of Rocky? I liked it. I thought it fit. And, you know, obviously there's this one sequence where he's playing around with different voices.

SPEAKER_01 16:14

Well, explain that a little bit though. What what are you talking about?

SPEAKER_02 16:18

Well, he talks through a computer, through a laptop.

SPEAKER_01 16:22

Well, because Ryan Gosling makes that possible. Correct. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:27

And so he gets to pick kind of what the voice is gonna be. And he's playing around, and and at one point he says, you know, Meryl Streep can do anything. And sure enough, the writers call Meryl Streep, but she does it for real.

SPEAKER_03 16:42

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 16:43

And says, I am Rocky, and it's you know, Meryl Streep's.

SPEAKER_01 16:46

Well, and and and Gosling's character says, is there anything she can't do? You know, it's exactly a little bit of an inside joke there.

SPEAKER_02 16:54

And there's also there's five puppeteers that are working Rocky at any given time.

SPEAKER_01 17:01

Yeah, I continue to be amazed at that technology. I know it's it's it's old news now, but I ever and I've said this on the podcast before, but the way they can erase all of that stuff out from I'm still amazed by that. I I think that is that's amazing because you're right, they've got all these puppeteers. There's James Ortiz right beside Ryan Gosling acting out everything with him, and which must create its own challenges from an acting standpoint to act off to that. I'm sure I'm sure it has its benefits and its drawbacks, too. Well, but just space. I and I wonder if that if that led to, you know, the the the the emotional depth of the relationship of those two characters by Ortiz being in that close of proximity with Gosling, I wonder. Absolutely it did. You think so?

SPEAKER_02 17:56

Absolutely it did. And there was times where his daughters were voicing Rocky. So there's a couple of reactions. Ortiz? No, gosling. Gosling. His daughters, his two daughters, are saying stuff in Rocky's voice. And there's a couple of times you see him react. I'm dying to get the K. And I hope it has a commentary track so I can follow along and see where these things are hidden. I hope so, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 18:32

Uh just so the principal cast I just laid out, there's some others. Lionel Boyce plays this character named Carl, who has a pretty significant role in the film. Uh he works for Eva Strat, and he's I don't I don't know, is he really like a security, like a bodyguard type of guy or something? Like, because he ends up helping. He's like an assistant to Ryland Grace in in a certain portion of the film.

SPEAKER_02 18:57

Right. And there's also a kind of an interesting take with the title, Project Hail Mary. Yes. Full of grace.

SPEAKER_01 19:07

Right. Which I didn't put that together until after the fact. Yeah, me. And of course, I think of Doug Flutie with the famous uh Hail Mary back in 84. Right. Right. Against the Miami, uh, what, the Miami Hurricanes.

SPEAKER_02 19:21

Hurricanes, yeah.

SPEAKER_01 19:22

But and and one other uh I wanted to mention was Ken Lung, Mike, who plays Commander Yao, who's one of the three quote-unquote astronauts. This guy's a legitimate astronaut. You might remember Ken Lung's work, Mike, on a series called Lost. He played Miles and Lost. I don't even I just watched it. And you can't see his face.

SPEAKER_02 19:47

He's the Chinese astronaut. I got so caught up in him in Ryan Gosling pressing his face to the acrylic. Really, that was an homage to Superman.

SPEAKER_01 20:03

Remember when Superman Okay it's such an obscure you just took a left turn there with no context whatsoever. I mean, kid, you're gonna have to now explain that reference because it was it was funny.

SPEAKER_02 20:18

Yeah, at one point he he creates a villain, you know, and he's kind of miming it to Rocky, and he puts his face against a piece of plastic. And it's really kind of when you look at the was it the original Superman that was in? Yeah, because they're sent to the Phantom Zone, the three villains and Superman. I'm talking 1978. They're sent to the Phantom Zone, and it's basically them and a piece of acrylic.

SPEAKER_01 20:48

Isn't that the that's the beginning of the second one?

SPEAKER_02 20:50

Yeah, but it was done by Marlon Brando, who who he was paid for the second film, even though he didn't really appear in it.

SPEAKER_01 20:58

I love those characters with Terence State.

SPEAKER_02 21:00

Unless you see the Donner cut. Oop. There was another reference.

SPEAKER_01 21:03

There it is, Mike getting a shilling for the Donner cut, as always on the podcast. But yeah, there was another lost reference. I I couldn't help myself. I had to point that out. Yeah, I mean, you know, I did I did find I did care for these two characters. You know, it's it's just sort of like Luke, uh Yoda, Luke, R2 kind of vibe, sort of relationship going on. And I think obviously that's something Lord and Miller are going for, as is Andy Andy Weir's hoping for that, of course, too, with this portrayal on screen. And I do think you feel that by midway. In fact, it's not quite an hour in when we're introduced to Rocky. And from then from then on, I was just fully committed. Yeah. And and I I was it it was such an endearing character. And yeah, I I don't know. I went back and forth with the voice. Like there were certain parts that I liked it. And then other parts it was like, why would he sound like a caveman voice? You know, Rocky, no good, do this. Like it was Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 22:09

That's as advanced as we could get it with. It was a little inconsistent for sure. It was a little funny, but and I think though the emotion is definitely in the film. My only complaint is that this goes too long. It's too long, Mike. Now, what would you cut out? There's there's a lot, actually, I I could think of. Like a lot of the the space travel that they just kind of got hung up in. There's the scene with which wasn't in the the book of Sandra singing karaoke. It's a great sequence. I like that. Yeah. And I think people liking it.

SPEAKER_01 22:54

It was an emotional beat, you know, where where they were basically ri there's this realization that this this is only this is a one-way ticket for these uh astronauts and scientists that are making this trek. Right. And so it did have an emotional depth to it.

SPEAKER_02 23:13

Yeah, when he explains that to Rocky, Rocky's like, what?

unknown 23:18

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 23:18

What do you mean? Well, he felt almost betrayed in a sense.

SPEAKER_01 23:23

That's a little strong of a word, but Rocky is sort of like you said that uh Grace goes home or something. Like what is what what are you talking about? Um Yeah, there were certain there were certain scenes where I think they it was certainly intended that there was going to be a greater emotional impact that didn't that I didn't think were successful. Yeah. And then many that that certainly were, I mean, for sure. Uh, you know, there there's there's a pretty intense sequence where there's this somewhat catastrophic event that takes place on the spaceship, this interstellar spaceship that that Grace is in and Rocky, and they both end up in a precarious situation as a result of it. That was a very emotional, you know, one of those scenes where the sound just cuts out of the film and you're just left with the visuals, and it's really stunning, I felt.

SPEAKER_02 24:18

And as you bring it up, I thought the sound throughout the film was excellent. The background sound just kept the thing moving. This would have been, I think, would have felt much longer if it wasn't for the soundtrack. And I don't necessarily mean the songs. There's a couple of times like they play a Beatles song, right? Just the right time, and it pulls off just the right emotion.

SPEAKER_01 24:44

Right.

SPEAKER_02 24:45

But just the soundtrack alone, like the Danny Elfman kind of stuff.

SPEAKER_01 24:50

Yes, that worked so well for me. It was good. You mentioned the karaoke scene. Uh, it was uh a Harry Styles song, Sign of the Time, that she's singing, and which is a great track. Uh, he's a super talented artist. And uh so yeah, those moments were were pretty emotional. I think there were others. I mean, I remember in the trailer, I was very struck by hearing Oasis's track, Champagne Supernova. That was a great track to put over the trailer. So music again plays a great part here in this film. There was, I guess there was a sequence in the book that has a has a there's this nuking of Antarctica, I guess, that takes place that I didn't know that. Andy Weir had really hoped that that was gonna it didn't end up making it in, but uh and there was some other there was some other subplot in the book about Andy Weir or not Andy Weir, but uh Grace's uh Ryland Grace being one of only a few people who have this gene that makes them resistant to these long-term induced comas. Correct.

SPEAKER_02 26:00

Which is one of the reasons he was picked.

SPEAKER_01 26:03

Well then no, not in the film. They got rid of that. They got rid of Well, I thought I thought it was in there. No, they make some like sort of Yeah, they make kind of an inside reference to it by saying, Well, there's a bravery gene that all of the astr you know, astronauts share or something like that.

SPEAKER_02 26:21

But now did you pick up on Grace that he's referred to as Grace, which is his last name. It's Dr. Grace, but Rocky calls him Grace, and he goes by Grace. And every time he would have a memory thinking back, the screen would go wide, wide aspect. Did you catch that?

SPEAKER_01 26:42

Well, the uh that I you know it's interesting that you bring that up, uh, and and that's a great observation, Mike, because they Lord Miller specifically used different aspect ratios for, you know, like it was it was t a tall aspect ratio when they were in space, and when they were on Earth, it was a wide aspect ratio. But I I really it wasn't I wasn't picking up on it consciously while I noticed it at the time.

SPEAKER_02 27:12

And it was every time he would think back, he would kind of go into these little memory waves.

SPEAKER_01 27:18

Yes. Well, in that that that was funny because that's what I was just about to bring up was we we hadn't really commented on the fact that the throughout the film you're you're both in the present in space on the Project Hail Mary while also flashing back to his recruitment into the Project.

SPEAKER_02 27:39

Correct.

SPEAKER_01 27:40

Yeah, I you know, which is leads me to one other I call it a criticism, but what I wish that we had learned more about Grace's origin. You know, who is Ryland Grace? We don't, other than being a molecular biologist, he's a middle school teacher, he's alone. You know, we he had a relationship that failed. Right. I we don't know anything about him, and I found myself and I guess in some ways, you know, maybe that sets up a sequel. I don't know. There's a longing to learn more about this character. So I guess in some ways you can say that is a credit to Goddard's writing, perhaps.

unknown 28:21

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 28:22

Wanting you to know more without revealing it.

SPEAKER_02 28:24

You know what I mean? Right. And I I think if they did, it would have made this even longer, causing maybe a little more like I'm glad I didn't see this in the theater, which is weird to say. Because this would look really good on the big screen.

SPEAKER_03 28:41

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 28:41

But I felt like I was in my comfort zone watching it on my home TV. I think that was a I was able to hang in. Where I think in the theater I might have got a little fidgety.

SPEAKER_01 28:54

Well, I was also I I I think I appreciated for the fact that I was able to have multiple viewings of it. Yeah. You know, and to go back. And I think it is one, I don't know, if it got like a criterion treatment or something like that, I would probably uh I would probably go in for it and purchase it.

SPEAKER_02 29:12

Uh I think it would be a a good one to do for either Arrow or one of these companies to really do a deep dive. Yeah, I think he sold the book rights for three million up front. Right. So he knew they were gonna put some money into the film.

SPEAKER_01 29:29

Well, and they they optioned this, interestingly, they optioned it before the book was even published. Yeah. This goes back to 2020, which is phenomenal. I mean, I think probably based on the success of The Martian, right? You know, they're like, we're gonna roll the dice on this guy. He he obviously knows what he's doing, and you gotta assume that we're gonna get something similar with Artemis. But yeah, Mike, the the runtime you mentioned, two hours thirty-six minutes. The first cut of the film, Mike, was like three hours and thirty minutes.

SPEAKER_02 30:00

Yeah, see. So think God for editing hung in. Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 30:03

No, no way, no way.

SPEAKER_02 30:05

No 'cause that was my one I I kept thinking they were stretching things out.

SPEAKER_01 30:10

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:11

Where they could have tightened it up.

SPEAKER_01 30:13

Talk to me about the budget, Mike. Now we're talking all in, probably 400 million, all in, right, you know, with advertising, marketing, the whole thing. Worldwide, about six hundred and eighty-two million. Give me some thoughts on on that. Well for what you've seen now.

SPEAKER_02 30:30

And again, uh the the the rule of thumb is two and a half times, it's gotta make two and a half times its budget to turn a profit. But I think this is likely gonna turn a profit. Now I'm surprised, Dan, with all the films we looked at last year.

SPEAKER_03 30:48

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 30:49

That this didn't get more or or when was this released? Was it actually released this year?

SPEAKER_01 30:57

March twentieth, twenty twenty-six.

SPEAKER_02 30:59

Okay, that's why.

SPEAKER_03 31:01

Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 31:01

So the awards for it would come next year. And by then it'll be kind of forgotten.

SPEAKER_01 31:08

It's old news, yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I hate to say it.

SPEAKER_02 31:11

I one of the things I thought was really cool is this is the first film trim premiere in space. They actually sent out a satellite and they beamed it in out of outer space. So that's very cool.

SPEAKER_01 31:28

Yeah. Well, uh, look, they they were using a lot of like the the ISS, you know, the space station and and lots of other references they use for the making of this film. I mean there's um Charles Wood, Mike, is was the production designer on the film. And one of the things I found fascinating was the use of 3D printing now in in how that can assist the filmmakers in, you know, like pre-vis, you know, and storyboarding. I mean, this is this is storyboarding on a whole other level. Like they literally can create the sets in model form, and you know, you can not only get a sense of how it looks, but how it's going to behave and how the characters are gonna respond in that environment. And it there's so much information. Because I don't see any of that. Yeah, it was a on YouTube, you can look it up. Uh Adam uh Savage, I think his name is, who does a lot of these types of behind the scenes sorts of uh videos. He's got some great ones on the Mandalorian and Grogu, but he talks to Charles Wood, and there's you see all the models and everything that they use. And um and he talks about how 3D printing was was heavily used in the construction of those models, but the way that it it helps the or assists the filmmakers in problem solving, you know, okay, well if like they talked about how the the centrifuge feature that you see in the film where they're creating gravity versus the zero gravity, and it's hard to explain unless you see the film and how that works. But you know, that the the 3D models were instrumental in them learning the physics and the different, you know, the how they needed to construct certain things because in some sequences Ryland Grace is like standing upright, but the the how do you explain it? You know, there's like a coffee cup on a table, but it's vertical. It's really bizarre when you see it.

SPEAKER_02 33:43

It's you know what it made me think of is this year's SNL did a sketch where they were out in space. You know, they're clearly, you know, just hopping. You don't see them, so they can get away with it. Right. Was that actually Ryan Gosling's episode? I don't know if it was his episode or not, but it was really funny. It was one of the sketches of the year.

SPEAKER_01 34:06

I thought you would talk about the SNL sketch where they're throwing themselves down the staircase. I had never seen that before, and that was genius what they did. If you haven't seen it, folks, go out on YouTube and probably type in SNL stair sketch. I think it was Olivia Rodrigo who was the host who's very funny. Talented singer.

SPEAKER_02 34:28

It was a female host. I know that.

SPEAKER_01 34:29

Yes, and very talented singer. Super funny, too. Like Ryan Gosling. You know, they they're they're funny, they can be dramatic, etc. But uh, but that was very funny. But my I was also wanting to share, Mike, Charles Wood was the production designer on uh, or is credited as the production designer on Spider-Man Brand New Day, the film that's coming out. Wow. Also, Mike, Doctor Strange, Avengers Endgame, Avengers Infinity, like he's got mad chops.

SPEAKER_02 35:00

I know a lot of his work.

SPEAKER_01 35:01

Yeah, Guardians of the Galaxy, and then just because we were talking about it recently, get Carter, which I thought was funny. Right, right. And the um the cinematographer, Mike Greg Fraser, has worked on Dune, Rogue One, The Batman. Like you're talking about some heavyweights here they've got working on this film. It's it's really that's a hell of a resume. It is. Let's talk about the ratings, Mike, which we always do. Uh we always talk about IMDB. I don't know what Ebert has it on his side. Maybe you can look at it.

SPEAKER_02 35:34

I mean, he it's not him. So in a film like this, I don't even count.

unknown 35:38

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 35:39

Well, but you still look at the site, you know, to see what his team is saying.

SPEAKER_02 35:42

Honestly, I just look at what the score is, but I don't read anything.

SPEAKER_01 35:46

Right. Anymore. Because it's not him. No. Yeah. But IMDB, MetaScore 77, it's a little low, I think. That's low. It's low. Rotten Tomatoes, on the other hand, almost evenly split. Critics 94%, audience 95%.

SPEAKER_02 36:03

So that's See, that's where I thought it was. I didn't know the metascore was down there in the 70s. That's it is low.

SPEAKER_01 36:10

That's a couple of cruel And it's only about 60, I think, reviews or so. So it's not big. That makes a difference.

SPEAKER_02 36:18

But again, we won't go down the rabbit hole of our one other funny thing when this was announced. It was actually announced on April Fool's Day back in I think 2020. And Andy Weir said, um, teaming up Ryan Gosling and Emma Stone in another love story. She was gonna play Rocky. That was a total joke, totally fabricated. And then Ryan Gosling winds up being in the film.

SPEAKER_01 36:49

I didn't even hear, I never heard about that.

SPEAKER_02 36:51

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 36:52

That that April Fool's joke. That's funny. Yeah, this again, I think I I was my after my first viewing, I was like, I I I enjoyed it. I I thoroughly enjoyed it, but there were definitely like it there were certain points where the stakes didn't feel as high as I think they were supposed to, like, like they did in the Martian for me, if I'm just drawing a comparison. Where it was life and death. Every day. Which it was here too at certain points, right? Yeah. There I thought the the pacing was a lot slower in the first third of the film. I uh to your point earlier, I think there's things they could have sniped snip and em it down. Yeah. And I don't know. I you know, I I know they have to take some license and some artistic license, but I thought his training and him getting up to speed was maybe a little too quick. I mean, he goes from, you know, just being goofy middle school teacher to all of a sudden he's doing spacewalks and uh it was a little, yeah, a little a little crazy. But I did love there was some really humorous moments in it too, Mike. Like when there's one point where I think it's when Grace first meets Rocky, and they kind of freak each other out because there's no common language yet between the two of them. Right. And Rocky has this thing called like he he his his language and he understands through echolocation, basically through tones and sounds, vibration, right, is how he paints a picture of his environment, his surroundings, which is pretty fascinating. Yes, it's a real thing. Um, but they do this like Ryan Gosling realizes that he's mimicking him, and so he starts doing like the cha chain putting his hands up and it's really you know, kudos to the puppeteers because again, to make that all work, you know, you need Gosling to deliver the goods, but you also need the the collaborative efforts of that puppeteering team they called the Rocketeers to be able to pull that off.

SPEAKER_02 39:11

There's a great callback at the end of the movie to the little dance and the wave. There is. I thought that was pretty touching.

SPEAKER_01 39:19

There is. There's a bit of an ewok moment at the end, which it was again, that was a little nitpick for me. I thought it was a little kind of goofy, but it was funny. It was cute.

SPEAKER_02 39:30

I didn't really understand how he went from communicating with sound to getting it into words. That past me.

SPEAKER_01 39:42

Well, he had a software program on the laptop that he was using to determine you know what what tonal frequences or whatever equated to a certain word. I mean, they had to do that in about two minutes, but I'm sure that's a longer process to get there with the technology, but essentially that's what it was.

SPEAKER_02 40:05

And so I Yeah, for me, I just felt like they went from tapping on the thing to all of a sudden having full dialogue.

SPEAKER_01 40:13

Well, I will add to that by saying, yeah, I mean, certainly it got a little too conversational uh shortly after that point. Like all of a sudden Rocky's talking in full and complete sentences, and you know, he'd throw some slang, and it was a little bit much.

SPEAKER_02 40:31

He figures out how to get inside the vehicle that Ryan Gosling is in, which that was pretty fascinating stuff.

SPEAKER_01 40:41

It was really fascinating. I mean, this uh like terraforma kind of thing. It makes me think of in in The Man of Steel. You remember that whole sequence with the terraforming that those like spacecraft was doing and you know what I'm talking about? Yeah. That sort of it made me think of that, but yeah, it was really fascinating. Like he could basically, I mean, speaking of 3D printing, it was almost what I was thinking of with Rocky, he could replicate really anything because at one point when they meet, he's got a replica of like Grace's ship and Grace himself, and he's doing a little puppet show for him, stuff like that.

SPEAKER_02 41:25

And it was funny because Ryan Gosling's response was using ramen noodles to create Rocky.

SPEAKER_01 41:32

That was really funny, yeah. And and there's a scene earlier there where early after he comes out of the coma, he's just exploring the ship, trying to figure out where he is because he doesn't know where he is. He's his memory is slowly returning.

SPEAKER_02 41:49

Right.

SPEAKER_01 41:49

Very confused state. Very confused. So he finds some bags of vodka on the ship from one of the the shipmates that passed away, and he's drinking the vodka, and he's eating ramen with like mustard on it. It was pretty nasty, but yeah, yeah. There were there were some very humorous moments. Now let me ask you, Mike, what are your thoughts on a potential sequel for Project Hail Mary? Do you think that can work?

SPEAKER_02 42:12

Or do you think Leave Well Enough Alone? I say Leave Well Enough Alone. I really liked the film. I think they could have tightened it, but I wouldn't go the same way, I wouldn't make a sequel. He's made making Artemis, right? That's kind of a step forward in technology and more modernized. So that's good, but I wouldn't go anywhere with this.

SPEAKER_01 42:37

So you don't see a Grace Rocky trilogy in the works.

SPEAKER_02 42:41

No, I don't.

SPEAKER_01 42:42

But don't you think the temptation is too strong with what it's done at the box office? Yeah, it'll be there.

SPEAKER_02 42:49

You know, somebody's gonna, you know, offer it. But whether or not he'll write it or they'll make it, I don't know. I really there's two movies out in the ether right now. There is solo, which we like the Ron Howard 70% version. But I really want to see the Lord and Miller version now. You never will. There's a Batgirl movie that they spent hundreds of millions of dollars on with Michael Keaton in it.

SPEAKER_01 43:23

It's it's so strange that you would bring up Batgirl because I just happened to cr upon a clip earlier about how uh if I understood correctly, they've lost most of the footage from that production, anyways. Which is if I if I understood it correctly. And you know, Brendan Fraser was gonna be in it, and uh it yeah, it's a shame that that that's not gonna see the light of day. I mean, maybe may who knows, maybe down the road it'll somehow find a home. If if what I'm saying is not correct, of course.

SPEAKER_02 43:57

Right. And you know, I I remember watching somebody talking about solo saying the Lord and Miller version will absolutely positively get put out there. It's not there's no way.

SPEAKER_01 44:11

It's never going to see the light. I mean, they basically made a deal, and they ended up getting executive producer credits on the film, but that's as far as far as far as it went. Yeah, these guys, they definitely have chops. I mean, you know, one of the criticisms and and one of the reasons they got fired, reportedly, was that they were trying, they were going for a more comedic, sort of fast-paced, comedic approach to solo. Not that there were not comedic elements in solo. There certainly were, as there have been in all Star Wars films, but but uh that is not what Lucasfilm was wanting. They were wanting more of a you know, a Western space film to be a bit more dramatic, too.

SPEAKER_02 44:53

Again, Ron Howard being the director, he is, and we just found out that there's maybe going to be a Grinch 2 happening.

SPEAKER_01 45:01

It looks like it's happening, and it is Ron attached to it as well with Jim Carrey. And I hope Taylor Mont is it Taylor Monson who plays played the girl. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 45:11

Yeah, Cindy Lou Who. Cindy Lou Who, yeah. But my criticism of that was there wasn't enough source material. So we're gonna be able to do it. You're gonna have to write a new book.

SPEAKER_01 45:23

I I think you could. I think they could pull it off. I mean, and and I would love to see Jim Carrey in that role again. But yeah, so Mike, Project Hail Mary, I mean, I would recommend this film for anybody who hasn't seen it yet. I mean, many people have seen it, of course, but uh if you're just getting to it, like we were, you can find it on the streaming platforms. This one you're gonna buy only if it gets the full treatment? It depends on the treatment.

SPEAKER_02 45:51

You know, if it if it's just the movie, I don't I don't buy anything that's just the movie, maybe Godfather, which of course has tons of extras. But if they just bare bones this, no, I wouldn't I wouldn't get it. In fact, I'm shocked you watched it three times.

SPEAKER_01 46:10

Well, I wanted well again, I I couldn't put my finger on what it was that I was missing from it. Yeah. But I did, I I do think I was enjoying it a little bit more each time. And again, I wanted to get my use out of that MGM free trial.

SPEAKER_02 46:25

Right. And don't be shocked if the first half hour you're a little confused because it is very dense.

SPEAKER_01 46:33

Mike, I let's it is very dense. It is very dense, but uh but folks that are into science and math will certainly love it. But but I think anybody that would would enjoy this film. Again, it's got some very sweet qualities to it. It's funny, it's dramatic, great acting, it's a good story, uh, it's well researched. I mean, you you get it, there's a little bit of there's there's a little bit of something for everybody in this film, and and again, I just can't say enough about I don't want to say a 180 because it was never that I was down on the guy, but just what a fan I've become of Ryan Gosling. I just I just think he's just a fantastic, uh talented guy.

SPEAKER_02 47:10

And I guess what's the uh movie he plays the stunt man in that I didn't like? Fall Guy Fall Guy, which I liked. With Emily Blunt.

SPEAKER_01 47:22

Yeah, with Emily Blunt. I thought that was that was great. Maybe one you need to go back and give a second view of. Yeah.

SPEAKER_02 47:28

Yeah. I do I own it, so there's I have every reason to go back.

SPEAKER_01 47:32

But but he's got such a broad range, you know, and and he can do it all. He can do it all. And you know, quite frankly, Mike, now we haven't mentioned it on the podcast yet, but I'm just gonna I'm gonna lay it out there right now so that it we're manifesting it. There's no turning back. But the old brother podcast is gonna be at San Diego Comic-Con this year, Mike.

SPEAKER_03 47:52

What?

SPEAKER_01 47:53

Yeah, the O Brother Podcast is going to be You and me. With the two of us that you see here are good In this picture. It's like Cannibal Run. These bleeds, yeah, those bleeds. So stick those bleeds up your nose. Yeah. We're gonna be at San Diego, and and I I hope, and I certainly would expect for something to drop related to Starfighter, the Star Wars film starring Ryan Gosling. So I'm hoping that's one of the things we'll get at one of those panels that we'll be at with our press credentials, might I say.

SPEAKER_02 48:26

Right. And don't keep me out of Hall H or Hall H Saturday Night Live.

SPEAKER_01 48:32

It's just Hall H.

SPEAKER_02 48:33

Yeah.

SPEAKER_01 48:34

It's H, right. Who's keeping you out of Hall H? We're gonna front. I don't know.

SPEAKER_02 48:38

The last because I've been to Comic-Con a few times. Yeah, but I never got into any of the big events.

SPEAKER_01 48:46

Well, because you didn't have the credentials before, and now you do.

SPEAKER_02 48:50

Right. Although I I was there for free on their dime, they gave me an educators, you know, and I hired a few people from Sony and Disney while I was there.

SPEAKER_01 49:02

So yeah, Mike's good at the free grift. He's uh quite talented at that over the years. We won't go into that anymore. But well, there you go, folks. Project Hail Mary, it is streaming now. And I you might still be able to catch it at a theater near you. There were a few screenings of it still in my area, yeah, which I as you I do wish I'd saw it on the big screen, but it was still very enjoyable, you know, in the comfort of my own home. So highly recommend it. Uh, I did enjoy the film, so definitely recommending this one. Um, and I also want to continue to give uh uh thanks to folks that have been supporting the podcast, whether you're listening, whether you're subscribing on the YouTube channel, uh again, deeply appreciate all the support that uh that we're getting from folks out there. And again, once again, we love the engagement. So please don't be shy. Reach out into that comment section, whether it's on YouTube or there's a link in the show notes to all the audio episodes where you can communicate with Mike and I and let us know what's on your mind. Whether it's feedback on the episode, whether it's criticisms or support you want to give to the film that we're talking about or TV series or whatever it is we might be talking about, or you just want to rail on us a little bit, that's okay too, as long as long as you do it respectfully. That's all we ever ask, Mike.

SPEAKER_02 50:25

And we do respond. I mean, especially Dan.

SPEAKER_01 50:28

Absolutely to everything. Absolutely, yeah. So appreciate that. It's it's helping get the podcast out to more and more folks, and and we do appreciate that. So So you're gonna be a Comic Con. I I'm going to be a Comic Con. You're gonna be a Comic Con too. Me? I think so. You're part of the O Brother Podcast, you're one half of the O Brother Podcast. Yes. Wow.

SPEAKER_02 50:49

So if you're at in San Diego, my home away from home. That's right. Come up and say hello to us.

SPEAKER_01 50:57

O Brother on the Loose in San Diego. That's a scary proposition, but uh it's gonna be a lot of fun. I think it's gonna be a blast. But yeah, if you're going to be at San Diego Comic-Con, you've got to look us up. We'll be there for the entire uh event and we'll be covering uh every day that we're there. Uh it's gonna be a lot of early mornings and a lot of late nights, I think, Mike. So we're gonna need some caffeine or some Mount Dew or whatever it is that's gonna keep us up. But looking forward to it because this will be my very first Comic-Con. So I'm I'm super excited about it. But all right, Mike. Anything else to say about Project Hail Mary before we blast off here?

SPEAKER_02 51:34

It's a great watch. Good family film.

SPEAKER_01 51:37

Yeah, it is a good family film. I'm glad you mentioned that as well. Yeah. All right, let's go do it for another episode of the O'Brother Podcast. I'm your host, Dan Smith, alongside me as always, my brother from the same mother, Mike Smith, and we will see you next time.

SPEAKER_00 51:48

Bye, everyone.